Why I’m Not Vegan – Is anyone 100% Vegan ?

Why I’m Not Vegan – Is anyone 100% Vegan ?



Alright, this is John Kohler with okraw.com
! Today we have another exciting episode for
you! And this is one that you will definitely
want to pay attention to and watch the whole
thing. Because, you know, this is a topic
that’s very important to me, and I’ve
got a friend on, good friend, JD, who’s
going to explain to you and talk to you more
about this as well. And so the title of this
video as you guys saw is why I’m not 100%
vegan and neither are you.
John: So JD, before we get further, how long
have you been into a vegan lifestyle? And
JD is more hardcore than I am.
JD: Oh, I have been vegan for about 25 years.
John: Wow, yeah, so I have been in a plant
based lifestyle for 20 years. And if you guys
saw my previous episodes, you know I eat 99.9%
plants, you know, on a daily basis. I have
honey rarely, and in the past, I’ve experimented
with raw dairy, you know, like a bite here,
a bite there. I go to a farm, my friend has
raw, you know goats that we milk ourselves
and then I drink some or something. You know,
it didn’t agree with me and so I don’t
do any of that on a regular basis. And as
you guys know I advocate a plant based diet.
Eat as many plants as you guys can, and you
know I’d rather, for me personally I’d
rather convert a hundred people 80% vegan
than two people a 100% vegan because in the
end that’s going to do the people a healthier
job. They’re going to be healthier because
of it, and in the end it’s going to help
the animals more. So don’t get me wrong,
while I say I’m not vegan, I’m for a 100%
compassion towards other animals and other
people, but there’s reasons why I say this.
So JD, you know, are there any true vegans
out there? I mean, is it just living or breathing
in bacteria if you’re eating food they’re
spraying even organic pesticides to kill bugs
and then you’re eating food that got sprayed,
things that killed bugs, so now you’re,
you know, destroying other creatures and if
you’re driving your bike and you run over
ants or something and people kill spiders
cause they don’t like them, or people kill
ants but you’ll kill ants but not spiders,
but you’ll kill mosquitoes but you won’t
kill other bugs, I mean, where does it all
end, I mean is anybody a hundred percent vegans
that do no harm to anything in the world?
JD: I love your passion, John. It’s yeah,
so the first part of your question is do I
have I met anybody who is truly a 100% vegan.
I have yet, now they may claim, they may make
that claim and people depending on what they
know about life, what they know about what
they’re doing directly and what they’re
doing indirectly. So, like with your honey
thing, you may not have been stealing directly
or may have been given to you, or somebody
else might have milked. So there’s direct
and indirect, and there’s varying degrees.
Is it one thing to have an animal, so this
is where the black and white mentality starts
to break up and start to see some grey and
hopefully maybe more colors in the rainbow
here than just yes, no, black, white, right,
wrong, democrat, republican, whatever, you
know, you’re white, you’re black, you’re
you know. So we start to see that a lot of
this, there’s a melding, there’s not,
and a lot of people want to have the safety,
personal safety, security that they have the
right answer, that I’ve chosen the right
way. Because otherwise they feel insecure.
Oh, how in life am I going to get by if I
don’t have the right answers? Well, that’s
feeding into your insecurity. You’re attempting
to mask in insecurity. So life isn’t so
black and white. There may be a few elements.
But most things are very more rainbow, more,
there’s a lot of grey, there’s a lot of
variants in between. So somebody may call
themselves I’m a 100% vegan and then you
go well that bike when you replaced the bike
tires, did you make sure that those tires
didn’t come from an animal source indirectly?
You may not have run over maybe an insect
and you might in your house, oh i don’t
kill any ants, but certainly inadvertently,
I mean indirectly but not intentionally you
are killing animals. So do you still qualify
as a vegan and what is your qualification
as a vegan? Some people it’s only about
diet, some people it’s about ethics, some
people might say well keeping an animal in
a house with walls and you don’t let it
out that’s not true vegan, you need to let
them out in to the wild but then if they die?
Do you get one of the praying mantises to
put in your garden because they are carnivorous,
to eat the bugs so that your plants aren’t
gonna, and do you pay an organic farmer, vegan
organic farmer, to reduce and kill insects,
bugs? Is that part of the, because that’s
not an organic yes or no qualification. And
even in veganic gardening there’s going
to be some death. So this is more about degrees
and the non-vegans will debate us that oh
there’s so many animals killed by your vegan
farming. It’s like well, that’s there’s
still mono cropping, and there’s going to
be killing going on. And even when you walk
to your own garden. I mean I suppose maybe
if you’re growing micro greens you’re
not going to have. You know, but we have to
live in a world and we have to kind of pick
where we’re going to be able to be effective
in life and not drive ourselves crazy and
still have massive empathy, massive compassion
and awareness. But none of us are completely
aware of how our actions affect anything in
the world. Do we say you know I was originally
getting my bananas from south America but
then I learned that the airplanes when they
take off they kill birds , so I can’t get
bananas from south America because they are
flown here. I have to have somebody ride their
bicycle with bananas. You know we’re going
to have food come from places and that’s
going to require that there’s going to be
maybe road kill, an animal in the middle of
the night is crossing. So now what, do you
disqualify that load of bananas as no longer
vegan? They have to keep a log of did you
hit any animals on the road? So where do you
draw the line? And there needs to be an acceptance
in the vegan community so that we don’t
infight that people are at different levels.
Different levels of information, different
levels of awareness, different levels along
their path. There is this fight that you need
to be an abolitionist or a welfarist and the
two there’s nothing that the two can learn
from each other and you have to be on one
side or the other. And that’s really a false
dichotomy, it’s a fallacy that there’s
only two choices, it’s only this or that,
when there can be multiple choices you can
pick, you know. I don’t like that one aspect
of the abolitionist approach. But I like all
the rest. And I have a, I have a, and see
they’ll call people that, and I’ve asked
people numerous times. So they want all these
orginizations to be absolute, they have to
switch, you know, it’s like they, the analogy
is with slaves you have to, are you an abolitionist
or are you a welfarist? They can treat the
slaves better? Well, some people you approached,
you know, and that was your foot in the door.
Hey you know, if you provided maybe if you
didn’t mess with them sexually, maybe if
you didn’t abuse them so much , maybe if
you talked to them this way, and that was
the foot in door to say hey you know what
I start thinking of these slaves more as a
human. Because the human mind doesn’t, it’s
not a light switch, it doesn’t go one day
you’re vegan and the next day you’re not
vegan. You have to go through a number of
steps, mentally something, you don’t all
of a sudden you’re a 100% vegan the next
day. It’s more of a dimmer switch. And this
is very difficult for people to understand
because they want to be, most humans are driven
by a social unity community and this is why
a lot of people have a different time moving
away from their meat eating habits because
most of their social network is that. And
they will, it’s a monkey see monkey do,
I mean you can look at through society and
see that most of our behaviour is mirrored.
I mean you can be shaking your head like that
and the next person will be they’ll be shaking
their head, you cry like ahh, you cross your
legs you cross your legs and they will mirror
you. You can do this all the time. You can
learn neuro-linguistic programming techniques.
And so we , because it’s a built in survival
mechanism, because once you are excluded from
the tribe it was a serious life or death situation,
you were no longer in the group, forest venturing
for food or for a hunt or for growing crops
you were on your own. And children, this is
one of, they’ve had children die because
they weren’t cuddled, they weren’t connected,
they weren’t. We even have oxytocin in our
blood that’s a hormone that gets, it’s
a bonding hormone, so people feel that if
they have to join one tribe or the other and
they can’t have that really just speaks
to them not being completely secure with hey
you know what there’s some things I agree
with John, believe it or not, not a 100% and
yet we’re still a community here. And we
don’t have to go hey put your gloves on
let’s go ahead. You might mentally have
a few things, hey you know this is my opinion,
but it’s really the infighting that’s
a major part of slowing down the plant based
vegan movement and there’s been suggestions
that oh you know we need to unite with all
these other organizations. And I think if
they saw how attractive we are, how empathetic
we are to all kinds of people, non-vegans,
vegans, all of us, not all of us, most of
us were not vegan. And we are on a gradual
skill to learn more and more about ah you
know I never thought about that the insects
John you mentioned that, are they killing
the insects on my vegan food, I don’t know
do they just go out there and squeeze them
you know to kill them off? Even if maybe Mary,
I buy the organic produce from, how do I know
she’s not out there using soaps or the insects
die? Hey it’s not vegan anymore. So are
you aware of that? Is that something you go
oh wait a minute here, what do I do if my
micro greens start getting white flies? Do
I you know go, are they sentient beings, am
I where’s the line, am I crossing the sentient
being line? Or are they just non-sentient
and I can just wipe them out? What do you
think?
John: Yeah I mean those are definitely big
questions and you know I really want to encourage
you guys to think, I mean this is my 20th
year on being on a raw vegan diet and while,
you know, I say I’m not vegan it’s because
of these small inconsistencies. You know,
yes I eat some honey maybe once a month, but
more importantly than if I’m eating honey
or not, whether I’m vegan or not, it’s
whether I’m thinking about how the honey
was produced, right. I do not buy honey out
of the stores because those are probably produced
in really crazy methods, right. The bees are
you know, shifted around on semi-trucks to
pollinate crops. So if you’re eating like
almonds, you know, they use enslaved bee labor
to pollinate the almonds and 70% of crops
are grown need the bees and the bees are being
devastated. One of the reasons is because
of the mass industrial farming system. And
so I like to get locally produced honey and
hopefully the bee keepers are being more sustainable
and being nicer to the bees. A lot of honey
is stolen from the bees and then the bees
are fed you know sugar water, whether that’s
a GMO sugar water or corn syrup. And then
they take that in and that’s what they’re
given to live on, which is not healthy in
my opinion. And then they regurgitate that
into the next batch of honey. So it’s very
important if you do choose to get honey, you
know, is to know where it comes from. So my
goal is to keep my own hives so that I will
only harvest a little bit of honey when the
bees have a lot, because the honey is for
the bees it’s not for us. And also I believe
that you know, concentrated sweeteners whether
it’s honey, agave, you know, maple syrup,
any concentrated sweetener we should not be
consuming in any large amount like most people
are consuming far too much. The best sweetener
in the planet- fresh fruits, right. The next
best sweetener after fresh fruits, dried fruits,
right. So get a local honey, know the source,
raise it yourselves, treat the bees compassionately,
and you know, just have a little bit because
we’re not supposed to even eat these processed
sweeteners , honey or otherwise.
So another thing, JD, I really want to get
in to is you know there’s all these different
inconsistencies. And anybody can pick at anything,
I mean, I’m proud enough to admit that I’m
not vegan, you know, by my definition. Now
other people may have definitions of being
vegan but by my definition because I eat honey
and you know whatever squish some bugs in
my garden you know so that I can grow my own
food, which is more sustainable than what
you guys are doing, cause I probably kill
far less bugs than what the produce that ends
up on your table that you bought through you
know on major monocultures that aren’t doing
it in a more biologic fashion that don’t
have high quality good soil that grows healthy
plants that are going to just resist bugs
in the first place, right. I’m doing the
best I can here. And also, you know, I try
to educate people about eating more plants
and not eating animals and being more compassionate,
whether that’s to animals or to people,
you know. As you get older hopefully you’re
getting more wiser and there is this, you
know, intolerance of anybody that’s not
vegan online by some people that teach online
which I think is not vegan when there’s
this intolerance and people are just outright
mean because you, you know, nobody’s perfect,
I mean that’s what it comes down to. Nobody’s
perfect and I want all you guys to do the
best you can.
So, JD, what do you mean you’re not a 100%
vegan ?
JD: oooh
John: You’re my vegan friend that’s so
vegan, right?
JD: And you’re on vegan groups and you know
all that
John: You’re on vegan groups. How to advocate
for vegans and get more people to turn vegan
?
JD: You’re going to have to send me away
to the non vegan island and thrash me and
teach me a lesson. So go ahead teach me a
lesson. You know, we got from the bike store
inner tubes that we were going to use to,
we were testing out to use for wallets and
so they throw them away, bike inner tubes.
But we didn’t check if they are vegan or
not. We don’t know. Oh you’re not vegan,
you made this little pouch for your son for
pencils and that bike tyre wasn’t made with,
you didn’t check if it was vegan. You used
fossil fuel. Don’t they go into the ground
and they wipe out an area, and don’t they
pollute and they have spills and all that
killing all that wildlife and you know, getting
them sick and they dig into the ground, leave
these big holes? Don’t you use energy from
the electric company? Where do you think they’re
getting that from? How are they burning that
gas, where are they getting it from? In order
for me to be, these clothes, you know, this
is not organic cotton, and even if it was,
even if it was, like John there’s dyes on
it and those dyes once it’s put in the landfill
might kill microbes because they’re toxic.
So, and the polyester threads you can’t
compost this. Even though the cotton material
might be organic. But what was that machine
doing across the field wiping out all those
gophers and animals? And so there’s people
that wear, I even think you know , people
that wear they bought a fur coat but it’s
fake fur. But they’re promoting a non-vegan
lifestyle. And so they’re promoting this
is what, so how are non-vegans to know, they’re
supposed to go on interviews, it there a tag
on it that says vegan for fur? No. Is that
a fake leather belt or pleather? It looks
like it’s leather. So you’re promoting
leather, you’re promoting the idea of enslavement.
And your shoes, you bought leather looking
boots, whether they’re smooth or they look
like alligator something. But they’re plastic,
so what? I mean, that’s for you selfish
you, yeah that’s for you but now you promote
it , oh I want to have boots like her. And
so you’re promoting this idea that, and
do they go and interview you? People that
see you walking on the street? Is that your
promotion of the vegan lifestyle? You know,
what happens if you have leather shoes when
you are not vegan? Do you throw them in the
landfill? Is that what being empathetic and
thinking about that cow, is that where it
would want it’s body or say well maybe I’d
like to be used? Maybe I’d like to either
finish out the life of those? Maybe I don’t
want to use? Because now you’re promoting
leather. Maybe if you give it to the thrift
store they’re going to throw it in the trash.
A lot of the things in the thrift store end
up in the trash, people don’t realize, it
doesn’t all get sold. And is someone else
going to wear that and promote and show off
that they have leather shoes. Now you’re
helping someone with what was in your closet.
But what are you going to do? So there’s
not like this black or white, this is the
right, this is the wrong. So there’s all
kinds of things that are in our environment.
It’s like John had mentioned, the bees that
pollinate, you know. Did you meet the person
that drives that truck around with the bees?
You know, there’s people that actually travel
with bees. How many bees are being killed
in this transportation back and forth? There’s
people for hire that are pollinators that
take their bees around. How many bees died
in that process? Is that vegan? You’re buying
vegan you know what you think are vegan almonds.
Is all of your food veganic? I don’t know,
it’s I mean, how many foods do you know
of that are veganic that you’re buying?
So, are you a 100% vegan? I doubt it. So you
know, I hold myself lower than a Jain, you
know, I’m somebody who’s trying to transition
my life, who’s trying to connect with people
who can educate me to make ah that’s you
know I didn’t think about that, I didn’t
think about that fake fur that I’m promoting,
that’s an interesting idea. It wasn’t
my idea, someone told me that. So, I’m not
a 100%. You know, gee, it sure would be nice
but with all the parameters, because veganism
isn’t just about what you put in your pie
hole. It’s about a lifestyle. Unless you’re
a health, what we call a health vegan. People
referred to beyond just the egocentric, just
yourself, selfish, it’s just me, that’s
what’s called either a egocentric or health
it’s just about me. And then if you go,
there’s some people using other terms ethical
vegan where it’s more than just diet, it’s
about ethics in your life. And so it’s a
topic of heated discussion that we’re trying
to have more dialectic rather than heuristic
combative discussion and we can all learn
and learn ways in which we have resolved in
our own minds and not just egocentrically
for ourselves but how it reflects to our world
around us.
John: Wow, I mean, there’s another way that
I figured out I wasn’t vegan, right. My
girlfriend made me aware of this one, JD,
not joking. She didn’t want any non vegan
condoms in her. And most condoms are actually
non-vegan because they contain casein in the
processing. So I mean even condoms and these
aren’t chief condoms, these are just standard
latex condoms but they use the casein in the
manufacture. So there’s very few brands,
Sir Richard’s I think is one of them, they
sell them at like whole foods. There’s a
few other brands that they don’t use the
casein in, and then there’s also of course
the polyurethane condoms from Japan that you
know don’t have better that are vegan also.
JD: Do you go to the store and use plastic
bags to take your stuff on? Because they put
a slick product so the bags don’t stick
together and that’s not vegan.
John: Oh man
JD: (laughter)
John: There’s so many different things.
I don’t know if anybody is even really vegan,
so
JD: We’re trying
John: That’s the whole thing. We just need
to do the best you can. Do the best you can.
Be aware about all these things and try not
to use the products that aren’t vegan and
support things that are more natural and you
know, and re-use things if they aren’t vegan
and you already own them instead of getting
rid of them because I think that’s much
more important.
So JD what are your thoughts on like if you
already have leather shoes or you know a leather
jacket, you talked about you know promoting
these, so what if you still have them and
you’re vegan and you still wear these things?
I mean is that good, bad, right, wrong? I
mean, you’re going to be penalised by vegan
police or what?
JD: It’s a very challenging question when
you think divergently rather than convergently.
When you think about all the possibilities,
not just yourself for your own consumption,
me walking on an island and there’s no other
human beings, can I use my leather jacket
by myself? Can I use my belt? Maybe I can
hide it over my shirt, people won’t see
it. Or you know, shoes, you work in an office
and nobody really sees my shoes under the
table. So there’s various situations. I
think talking to people and saying yes these
maybe are leather shoes and they’re my last
pair. I bought and I’ll show you my other
pair. I don’t want to throw them away, I
don’t want to put them in the landfill,
I don’t want to give them to the thrift
store cause somebody else would throw it.
At least I can have a message about why it
would have been a good idea that I never bought
these in the first place and what actually
goes? People think leather is natural. There’s
so many chemicals to make a living thing , a
living skin stay alive for decades. Those
chemicals enable it to stay perfect. It’s
filled with a lot of chemicals. And those
people that do that industry and often not
in protective clothing, protective gear, depends
on where the leather comes from. So it may
have initially been a natural product but
it’s not natural anymore. But it’s a very
challenging thing to wear those things. And
you’ve got to ask yourself the question
– what type of a situation am I going to
be in when I wear this? Is it just around
my house to stay warm in this fur jacket that’s
a hand me down from my mother. And then I
didn’t know at that time, and now I’m
vegan, what do I do with this jacket? It’s
kind of a keepsake for my memory of my mom
but I kind of just wear it around the house.
Okay well that’s different. Or you know,
I’m going to a fashion outing and there’s
hundreds of people that will see me and they’ll
think wow I thought you were vegan, now you’re
wearing this jacket. You’re not going to
go around with a card to everybody explaining
your story, so it’s challenging. We’re
in transition here. You know, we’re small
in numbers, let’s do the best we can to
make a good face to the public, a good interaction
and get our message across. As I was, as I
explained to people so it’s not a do nothing
do everything. A non vegan might say oh well
you can’t be a 100% so why bother? It’s
like, well, you know, the person walking on
the beach throws a starfish into the ocean.
Well I made a difference for that one. I can
for that one. I can’t maybe save all the
starfishes on the beach but I can do what
I can. I see someone in a violent situation,
they may be being abused or something, maybe
being raped, can you stop all rapes in the
world? No. But you may be able to do that
for that instance. And you may be able to
stop that person from doing it again. The
ripple effect. By how you interact. So you
do what you can and by having empathy it’s
hard to look back. It’s like they say once
a parachute is open it’s hard to close it.
So once your mind if open to empathy, if you
have the courage to put yourself in another
being’s mindset, in their history, in what’s
gone in in their life, then it’s hard to
be selfish again, to only think from your
perspective. So it’s when you choose am
I going to keep the belt, am I going to keep
the jacket, the shoes? Empathize with the
kind of people you’re going to interacting
with. Are these people you can have a conversation
with or are they just strangers walking by
that think oh there’s a guy, that’s cool
leather shoes, I want to save up and buy money
like that guy. Then that’s a different message.
That’s a, you know, how can you use this
to the empathy advantage, to the vegan message,
to the non violent way of interacting in the
world where you do what you can to have as
many people win. You know, Gandhi could have
said, well geez I can’t free every Indian,
I can’t, so why even bother? Any kind of
social move, I can’t free all the slaves,
why free one? Why, all the, you know, we’re
doing what we can. Oh I can’t get everybody
to be a home gardener so why even bother putting
up eighteen hundred videos, you know, why
should I even start? Just go crawl back under
the rock where I came from, you know. Not
that that’s where you came from, but you know
the analogy. But, you know, why even get started?
John can’t affect everybody but he’s doing
what he can and it’s snowballing, it’s getting
out there.
John: Yeah, and I want to encourage you guys
once again you know, do what you guys can
to affect change in others, however you guys
can do that, whether that’s talking to family,
getting connecting with other vegan groups
in your area, and you know getting to do some
proactive advocacy is what I like to say.
Because not all that in my opinion is definitely
a proactive
. And JD, what I really want to talk about
is this whole philosophy of you’re right or
you’re wrong, either you’re in or you’re out,
you’re good or you’re bad, you’re breaking
the law or you’re not breaking the law. Nothing
is ever really black and white except my sexuality,
I’m a 100% heterosexual right.
JD: Oh John, (laughter)
John: (laughter)
John: But um, everything in life is about
a gradient, it’s like think of that gas gauge
in your car, right. The gas gauge is either
full, it’s not full, or it’s not empty, it
could be somewhere in between, right. And
that’s how, you know, being a vegan is, you
know, you could be mostly to the full line
but you’re probably never there cause I mean
in his 25 years he’s never met anybody a 100%
all vegan because you know there’s always
something that’s going to have and when we’ve
got these lights up and, you know, there’s
bugs on the lights and maybe bugs get too
close to lights and maybe making this video
we’re not vegan now, I mean. How far are you
going to take it? It’s a thought process of
either right, wrong, good, bad, and I think
it’s what causes divergent or convergent thinking,
what does this mean and how can this benefit
my people by knowing that? Because I’m only
making this video to raise your awareness,
to get you guys to think for yourself. Instead
of thinking in the box, think out of the box.
Think differently and get some education that
you know, most people are not getting in this
life. Because we’re all taught to be in the
box, to follow the leader and not think for
ourselves and that’s one of the worst things
in my opinion you could do in your life.
JD: Yeah. It was challenging for me to get
out outside of boxes that I had adopted because
I hadn’t developed a healthy mental immune
system and a mental defence system. So as
there’s two terms- divergent and convergent.
So if you think of divergent and convergent,
like when something converges, kind of two
points coming together, so that’s the lesser.
And the divergent would be more like diverse,
you understand that concept. So convergent
thinking is when you really have limited options
or you reduce the number of options. So that
would be like a false dilemma that there is
only two choices or there is only three, when
really there’s more choices. So divergent
thinking is actually an element of genius.
Because most people that are considered genius
have to think outside of well I know this
and I know this but that’s not working, how
do I get through this situation? There’s a
famous TV show of the guy who, MacGyver, that’s
a perfect example. Here is somebody who had
to be very divergent in his thinking. He thought
okay well I have this element, I have a stick
and I have a rock and I have a pencil, how
can I get through this door using these items?
And most people are like ah you can’t do it.
So that’s a convergent thinking, you know,
you don’t have a key so that’s it, you either
have a key or you don’t have a key. Hey, it’s
a very similar thinking when people, one of
my former clients his son was shot and his
friend came over and was consoling him and
he said his son was delivering pizza and a
13 year old shot him to, he was supposed to
be giving him his, you know, give me your
money, this jerk for pizza event where they
call the pizza guy out and it’s a fake deal
and they try to get his money. And his senior
person in the gang he was hanging out says
bust his bones, and they shot him and it went
through his ribs and killed him instantly.
His, that’s Trichamiza, his father was Inchamiza
created the Trichamiza foundation long after
this or shortly after this. But his friend
came over and he said I would hand them, I’d
be so angry, send his father and mother to
jail and you know the whole community, and
he said I don’t feel that way. Now here’s
a guy who left Africa to come to America to
be safer for his family. And his son, his
extremely distraught, and he said that I feel
that there are victims at both ends of the
gun. Now here’s a guy who didn’t think oh
we either have to attack or do nothing, there’s
a third option. Imagine that, a third option.
How is that possible? So when another country
attacks twin towers, people think oh there’s
only two options, either attack them back
or you be wimps and do nothing. No, there’s
actually a third and a fourth and a fifth
option. But because we’ve been trained so
much in our school system in convergent, there’s
either yes or no on this question, circle
this dot or circle that dot, there’s only
four answers here. And you go oh wait a minute
I think there’s a fifth one. Nope, not on
the test. And you get that again and again
and again over time, and they’ve tested
children over the years, divergent, almost
a 100% of the population of the children they
tested and over the years it shrunk and shrunk.
Because they continued to believe that there
was so few options. You mean, could I do,
could I learn math and recess at the same
time? No, there’s only one option, you’re
either in math class or you’re not. Only two
options here. So you either have these four
answers or there’s nothing. There’s nothing
outside of these answers. So it’s this constant
over twenty two thousand plus hours we’re
taught this indoctrinization to think convergently
not. In some areas maybe if we took a science
class or maybe if we took creative thinking
class, there might be that, but if you look
back through history, they have purposely
eliminated logic. And that is the teaching
of how to reason, how to think about things,
not what to think, not just put it in your
head and spit it back out , which is called
rhetoric teaching, disseminating information,
learning grammar, learning what words are,
how to put them together and then is this
true, is two plus two equal five? I can check
that in math because I learned those four
basic things, addition, subtraction, multiplication,
division. That would be the logic part of
math. And if you didn’t learn the logic part
and learning about how we make claims and
statements which are called arguments, but
not argument in a debate sense, just how we
put a premise and a conclusion together. We
say this and this, so therefore equals this,
I believe this because of these premises.
And so these concepts are so new I don’t want
to get too heavy into this, but you know just
kind of the basics like I did with the math,
the addition and subtraction, multiplication
and division, that’s just basic math. There’s
calculus, there’s trigonometry and other stuff,
and there’s the advanced thinking. But just
basically knowing fallacies which are errors
in logic, errors in our thinking process.
Hardly few people and some people that know
those, just had to get those in liberal arts
classes in college. So, but during one point
when the Russians were ahead of us in the
space race, they added to the smart students,
the students that were ahead in class, they
added logic back in, because they wanted them
to get ahead. They wanted them to think divergently.
Think outside the box. They didn’t want the
rest of the students to do that. So, it’s
something that was in the original classic
renaissance thinking to think divergently.
They wanted a society that was ahead, that
was ahead in math and science and art and
athletics and all of this. The renaissance
wasn’t just about paintings and great paintings,
this was about art and throttle maximology.
This was the study of how to maximize humans.
And so they taught the trivium, which was
grammar, logic and rhetoric. And then the
upper four which I won’t get into were the
upper sciences – astronomy and other things.
So, they couldn’t get to the four, the quadrivium
four, until you passed the trivium. And so
now we’re basically through our indoctrinization
system that’s run by the government until
the year 2000. In most states, it was illegal
to home school your children. You could take
care of their health , be responsible to everything
else, but not their education. The government
was going to be in charge of that. And that’s
a huge red flag for you right there. As to
what the underpinnings was and why the structure
of the school system was created by industrialists
mostly, the structure of it. Not people who
were interested in creating magnificent human
beings, a magnificent society, a healthy prosperous
thriving society. This is all about jobs.
Who you’re going to be when you grow up, what
is your job going to be, job job job, do your
merit performance, do your outside performance.
Feel horrible as a human being but have all
these external measurements, your grades,
your money, your jewellery, your costumes,
your, and yet you feel empty inside. So this
is, you know, if you feel empty inside, you
went through probably twenty two thousand
plus hours in the school system learning convergent
thinking and you feel trapped. So you feel
like you have limited options which is where
you’re distorting the options, which is there
is a, most people when they’re having depression
it’s a distortion of reality, they’re either
compartmentalizing things or they’re distorting.
So a lot of people that are depressed see
few options for themselves. And so that’s
cognitive distortion, and you can look that
up on websites and Wikipedia and different
things and you can see those distortions that
people have. And you can say wow I’m, well
every time I’m depressed I’m having this distortion
here, I’m limiting my options when there’s
really these more options. Or I’m seeing
it only in a negative way and I don’t see
any positive aspects to it. So cognitive,
the convergent thinking really traps us. It
traps us in our business, it traps us in relationships,
it traps us in a business. It traps us with
the vegans and thinking that there is only
one way to do this, I have the answers, I
am now the dictator of what vegans are, and
you know the guy who originally started it
said it was this and if it’s not that then
you’re wrong and I’m right, I have the right
answer, I can go to sleep at night feeling
secure that I have the I’m holding the right
vegan Bible and have the right text and terms.
Come on, this is not where, we need to grow
ourselves as a family and everybody is at
different stages And they will grow even faster
through love and empathy and compassion and
‘yes and’, which is if you’ve ever taken
any improv classes it’s not ‘no but’, you
don’t end the conversation and stop it, you
go ‘yes and’, and you continue and you grow
it and you say wow so John you love all those
animals and have compassion for and you don’t
want them to steal and all that, you’ve probably
had more honey before and now you’ve reduced
your honey now that you’ve had all of these
other realizations, that’s great. And so as
a human grower like as if I were a rose gardener
I would spend more time growing roses than
picking weeds. I don’t want to go over to
John’s and pick weeds, I want to grow his
compassion for the bees. I want to grow, I
don’t want to oh John’s not here, oh he’s
a horrible person, he eats that honey, I got
to take him off the list and cross him out
and delete his videos and go away horrible
person. Come on, we can all learn, you know,
and John will educate me about and say hey
JD you know about this, and you know blah
blah blah I didn’t know about that, how come,
that’s good to know, thank you John. So we’re
all helping each other.
John: Yeah. At the same time JD will educate
me about convergent and divergent thinking
and all these others that I don’t get in to
normally. But also what you guys do is important
to me. As child I was in a gate program or
MGM mentally gifted minors so that she taught
me at a young age that think out of the box,
and I believe even above being vegan or into
raw foods or whatever, you guys really need
to start thinking outside the box that you’re
not as controlled in certain systems. Whether
that’s a vegan system, whether that’s in a
raw system, whether that’s in our political
system, whether that’s in our consumerism
system, right. And that’s what I really try
to teach in my videos aside from just the
food. A different way of thinking. And you
know I applaud you guys for watching this
video at least to this point, because it lets
me know that you guys are interested in you
know taking your health and you know yourself
to the next level. To not include yourself
inside a box and always look for different
options, right. One of the things I strive
to do on a daily basis is once something that’s
maybe not so good to me happens, instead of
being pissed off and angry, find a positive
benefit right. You could be, you know, you
missed your plane because some stupid people
didn’t open the door and you were there on
time, and this actually just happened to me
and some people were really pissed off at
the people in front of me because they missed
the plane just like I did. And they were really
upset and yelling and I’m like there’s no
point in yelling because that’s not going
to help you get your way. And you know, they
really need to get back and all that stuff,
and I just like, like okay you can be pissed
off or you could just be like, you know, not
do anything and just like brush it over but
still not be happy on the inside about it.
Or if you just feel like why you’re still
here, well maybe the plane was going to crash
and I’m not on that plane so I’m not going
to crash with it. Maybe I needed another day,
you know, in my location here to like chill
out and hang out and fast more and can be
here for my girlfriend because I’m not going
to be on that plane tonight you know. And
I want you guys always to look for options,
right. Don’t just like reduce and look for
one option or the other. And that’s why I
make these videos for you guys, to provide
you guys options. All my videos, over nineteen
hundred videos now, you’re always going to
learn something from my videos. And whether
you want to implement that in your life or
not, that’s a whole other topic. And you know,
the next thing I’m going to talk about is,
you know, that I’m not a 100% raw either.
Because just like being vegan, you know, people
that claim that they’re a 100% raw in my opinion
they’re lying. Actually I met one guy one
guy in all my time I truly believe he is a
100% raw vegan because he has ten acres in
Hawaii, he doesn’t like to leave his house
and he grows like the majority of his food
or all of his food actually, fruits and vegetables,
and he just eats out of his garden. He doesn’t
even like other stuff, right.
JD: And what percentage of the population
is that?
John: Yeah. Like nobody else does that honestly.
So I mean, I’m sure he’s eating like organic
produce that bugs have probably been killed,
so he’s probably not all vegan. You know,
but he’s all raw, I think, for the most part.
But even none the less, that’s an exception
of the rule and most people are not raw. I
mean I do my best with raw, 99.99% raw is
what I like to say. And in the olden days
you know, I don’t know, eighteen years ago
after a big break up I had some baked potatoes.
They’re still vegan, but I didn’t feel good
after. And I learned that if you eat baked
potatoes John you feel like the next day when
you wake up in the morning like a truck hit
you and you don’t have the high level energy,
you’re just not engaged or active or excited
about life. And I just didn’t like that feeling.
So I always want you guys to learn from you
know, your experiences. I don’t want to call
things failures and successes; I want to call
them experiences. And you could always learn
from your experiences, even if it’s maybe
not the positive one.
So, JD, what’s one thing or one technique
that somebody to use to break themselves out
of the box, to look at more options than just
right, wrong, vegan, not vegan, good, bad,
raw, not raw? And you know you could have
gradients, you don’t have to be a 100% vegan
or a 100%raw in my opinion, do the best you
can, get to the closest thing that you can
but be conscious of the decisions that you
make in your life. That’s the most important
thing.
JD: Yeah, just to go back for a second. So
Trichamiza, after he saw he realized that
there were victims at both ends of the gun.
And what that meant to him was is what kind
of a society would this be that would foster
a 13 year old and have him shoot another human
being? And so he thought that kid was a victim.
And so he’s actually been trying to get, he
was tried and convicted at for that age as
an adult in California to go as one of the
first ones or the first one, and he’s been
trying to get him out of prison and have him
part of the organization he created to work
with gang members to get them out of gangs.
To teach them that there is other ways to
getting what you want in life, other ways
to deal with conflict, other ways. So that
was what I would call the third option. And
so what people can do, it’s really challenging
in a world that most of us grow up in to not
think about what we think about. And a lot
of our thoughts can be very scary. So and
there’s more than just meditation. But just,
and you want to start to grow your habit of
checking your thoughts. Is this true, why
is it true, where did this come from, is it
from, did I just get this information and
I didn’t check it at the door of my mind,
I didn’t check it at my ears and my eyes,
is it true? Is it you know, simple things
that most people believe that they landed
on plymouth rock, they didn’t land on plymouth
rock, it’s somewhere else. But that’s what’s
so, there’s so much of this stuff that we
believe, but we don’t, we didn’t have the
defence mechanism the checking this mechanisms
when it came in. And so at this point a lot
of the stuff that we’re thinking and saying
is just going out because it came in. It just
came in with no bodyguard at the door to say
well we’re going to check this belief, I’m
going to run, you know, on the internet, I
can get a , you know verify these facts, I’m
going to check. And so just that alone will
move you and say wow am I really only thinking
about two options here, vegan, non vegan?
Are there really people that have gradually
improved, that are there some people that
call themselves vegan and maybe they’re not
aware that you know the occasional fish or
maybe drinking milk every now and then is
really not considered? Should I attack them,
get out my weapons and attack them? Or just
say hey you know here’s an opportunity that
I’ve learned sometime along the way, I’m a
little further maybe in that path and I can
say to you know this is why I would consider
that the fish or the meat wouldn’t, I wouldn’t
kind of disqualify my degree of veganism and
I can share that with you. Are there, you
know, like the saying goes, you can retract
more with honey than vinegar. And so just
the basic concept of like you would open up
your refrigerator and you would check the
food to see if it’s mouldy before you put
it in. So you would check things before you
eat at a restaurant. Oh that looks kind of
weird, what is that? So you’re checking things
at the grocery store, oh that looks like it
has some rotten spot on it. So we’re checking
things, we’re checking. Maybe we’ll buy some
clothes and check, oh this one has a rip in
it, you know, or this. So when we bring stuff
into our life we’re going to check it. So
again, what’s already in here it’s challenging
and it can be a lot of work but it can be
very simple. Check it before it goes out.
Check it before it’s spit out, it’s written
down, check it, write something down. A lot
of people have gotten into the habit of they’ll
send an email , put it in the draft box and
think about it overnight, and then read it
again and go wow you sound angry dude, wow
let me change this. Like it can give you a
little time and space to go how is this going
to be received. So that’s another not just
oh I don’t care what people think because
we we’re all emotional mental beings. We need
to be able to see how we receive things and
give things. Is it a gift or is it a weapon?
Are you not vegan as my weapon or you’re not
really vegan as my gift, can I share some
things with you? So checking, checking what’s
in there can be challenging but as it comes
up we can check it. Check it at the gate.
As the saying I’ve learned from my belief
was Jim Rohn or Zig Ziglar, “make it check
up from the neck up”.
John: Awesome, awesome. So what I want to
talk to you next about, JD, is now you consider
yourself vegan is that correct?
JD: I consider myself almost a 100% vegan.
John: Alright. So what is your definition
of vegan then? For everybody out there because
I mean, you know, in my opinion there’s no
true vegans but what is a vegan or what are
some of the qualities of a vegan that a vegan
should have if you want to put a label or
what somebody should do. I mean, I think there’s
really it’s more about the attitude of being
a vegan or what you really want to do in life
or what you’re moving towards? Like I definitely
you know, as you know, you want to call me
a vegan or not, I would consider myself a
kind of vegan but extremists wouldn’t call
me vegan. I mean, I’m a 100% for not eating
animals and not killing animals, number one,
right. That does not need to happen, right.
I want to also live with compassion. I think
that’s something also that’s very important.
So what are some other things that are important,
you know, that vegans are thought of or traits
that vegans are thought to have or should
have?
JD: Yeah. It’s, I’m sure I have it written
down and I’ve edited it and I have the right
words and the right order and the grammar
is correct and all that. For me it’s about
empathy. And empathy gets often confused with
compassion. And they are, they, they are as
similar and as different as John and I are.
You know, we’re two separate people. We have
some similarities but we’re different. And
the differences are is compassion is more,
I’ll use John as the example. I have compassion
that John is challenged by certain comments
online that he’s you know this and that because
you know he’s not a vegan a 100%, so whatever.
And so empathy, so that’s me thinking about
him. Now the empathy part would be me being
John, not thinking at John but me, how would
it be for me to receive those types of comments
being in John’s position, not for me how I
would receive them. Thinking about well John
grew up this way in life, John’s this kind
of a person, John really wants to help people
and he’s like wow I just want to help people
and somebody wants to give me these comments.
So I’m trying to think from his perspective,
not me in him but from his perspective. So
the same goes for animals. So as this cow
is having a baby and looking at her baby and
you know, and she’s connecting with her baby
and it’s having a bond and her chemicals in
her body and she’s licking it and cleaning
it and standing next to it and feeling good
wow you know I have this little baby. And
then someone comes along and says hey you
know what, I want your baby, I want to make
it another cow that’s going to produce milk
or I want to eat it when it’s young and its
muscles are soft and slit it’s throat and
boil the blood and do whatever, you know,
have some sacrifice and do something. And
so as that cow, how does that cow experience
that thing that’s going on? And that’s empathy.
Compassion is you’re thinking at about the
cow. Empathy is what would I do as a cow in
that position, not as a mystical I’m superior
and all the other non homosapiens sapiens
are less than and can be slaughtered and done
with, however. But it’s me stepping out of
myself. And that’s can be a scary thing. That
can be a courageous thing to get out of yourself,
to think about when you see someone, a human,
an animal, you see a dog being beaten, you’re
thinking oh that dog’s being beaten. You might
think wow if I was that dog and I’m being
beaten, what would I do, would I turn around
and bite? And somebody’s like oh you know
you shouldn’t bite, oh we have to put that
dog down. Well, me as the dog I’m, you know,
I didn’t appreciate that behavior, maybe the
dog is biting because it’s been abused. Let’s
have, let’s play an empathy position. What
was that dog’s life like? There’s a famous
story told about a school of fish swimming
by and they see this fish, it’s just going
crazy going around, and they just see this
line and they see this thing through its mouth,
they don’t know what it is, they’re fish,
they just see it flopping around like oh that
fish what’s wrong with it? And it’s a fish
hook in its mouth, and the fish is going crazy
and they’re like go away and they don’t understand
why that fish is freaking out. And they have
to say okay what’s why is that fish reacting
that way? Why is that non vegan acting that
way? Why is that vegan acting that way? Just
because someone switches to have empathy for
non human animals doesn’t mean they’ve also
automatically flipped the switch and have
that same kind of empathy or degree of empathy
for humans. For humans that may not be in
their intimate circle. Do they have the same
kind? There’s a lot of humans that think oh
you know, this cow I would do this or that
for a goat, but for some human who lives across
the planet they can care less about. So to
me having that empathy then makes you think
from their perspective and makes you think
well how would I like to have my life interacted
with as another being on this planet, not
as an inferior, not as an, you know. What’s
interesting is that certain animals can think
better than us in certain situations. They
have better eyesight in certain situations.
They can fly, we can’t fly, they can swim
better than us. So who is superior at what?
At what? At abuse, is that what we’re superior
at? Superior at slaughter, superior at polluting
our planet? I mean when you really, when I
look at it I think okay is there a superior
being? He or she kind of left not really the
most intelligent being as the superior, that
kind of throws the monkey wrench into the
works. I’m like really? We’re supposed to
be the top rung here and when you look around
it doesn’t seem that way for a lot of how
the humans behave, I wouldn’t consider us
superior in our behaviour. So there we can
look to other animals for their superior behaviour
and compassion and empathy and non violence
and community support and various things.
Intricate network of the ants and various
things, how they work and so that to me drives
me to think about how I conduct my life? Does
my empathy extend to sweeping my path like
a Jain person from the religion of Jainism
that predominantly people who reside in India?
Do I wear a mask? No, I’m not at that point.
So they can probably advise me on how to be
either more empathetic. I’m not saying my
empathy is at the all time peak and high,
I’m still learning, I’m still growing, I’m
still connecting with people. I used to kill
and slaughter animals, me personally with
my own hands. Cut them, chop them, kill them,
the whole works that was part of a family
business and so I’ve changed. And I’m still
learning along the way. And in the beginning
people could have attacked me. There wasn’t
that many in the vegan culture. It wasn’t
online back then 25 years ago. So there wasn’t
, there’s people mostly trying to help, not
attack me because I had added an egg and maybe
still didn’t think that was a big deal. I
didn’t know it’s going to be thrown away,
the chicken that didn’t produce. You know,
I didn’t know, it was my ignorance. So do
you bash me for my ignorance or can you help
me along? Am I asking for a hand up not a
fist? I don’t want a mental fist. We all shy
away from that. And you know, a lot of people
want to fight the vegans and it’s because
they come at them with a fighting stance.
So your energy is going to be matched. And
that’s another thing that I had mentioned
in the neuro linguistic programming, you know,
what kind of energy are you bringing to the
table? And is it attractive? Like the honey
or agave or the vinegar
John: Yeah a long time ago when I first met
JD we had like a head to head like about honey
and agave. He was more for agave, I was more
for honey. We can laugh about it now. We’re
probably both not happy about it, we’re both
not, we both probably shouldn’t eat them,
and when we do it’s in very small quantity.
Just eat fresh fruit man.
JD: Dates
John: Dates. And be happy, right. So JD, I
want to talk to you next about an insidious
product that you literally can’t get away
from in this day and age- plastic. JD, is
plastic vegan? I mean, surely that doesn’t
come from an animal right? So how could it
be not vegan?
JD: Yeah, it’s you pick who it is. It’s all
over our life. And it’s extremely rare to
have a conversation with someone or see a
conversation about any association between
plastic and veganism. And when you bring up
the topic, which I’ve done numerous times,
most people they run, they don’t want to,
they want nothing to do with the topic. What’s
the three fists, the eyes, the ears and the
mouth, right. You can watch the original planet
of the apes and they do that in one of the
scenes. The three jury or whatever they are,
the judges. So the plastic if you consider
where it comes from, how it’s extracted, how
it pollutes, how the by-products pollute.
We live in an ecosystem. And so if you consider
not just the macro, the big animals, to be
what you need to have empathy for. If you
consider smaller animals, if you consider
wildlife and birds and fish and all little
and small animals part of the eco system,
part of something you consider your veganism,
where does your plastic come from and where
does it go? And where it goes can be either
more insidious as you say, into the ocean,
in the landfill. Have you ever gone to a landfill
and seen the birds picking through the plastic?
If you’ve ever seen dead birds and see all
the plastic in their stomach, you see birds
washing up on the shore, plastic. Plastic,
and I’m just talking about just the solidified
plastic, just the hard pieces, I’m not talking
about the lint product that comes off in your
laundry, that comes off in your clothes that
microbes and animals have to eat in there,
what they’re maybe the water that they’re
drinking. So not just the products and so
the chemicals that go into that most plastic
manufactures are not going to divulge what’s
in there. They think it’s a secret recipe.
They also know if they divulge it that the
public will have an outcry against it. So
there is all kinds of toxic products and they
basically are policing themselves in what
they put in their products. The lead and the
cadmium and the metals and the toxins and
the BPA and what they replace the BPA, the
Bisphenal A, and what they replace it with
is often times worse, as an endocrine disrupter.
So that’s considered part of plastic, and
so what happens when we have a gyre, they
call it, larger than the state of Texas in
our Pacific ocean that the animals are feeding
off of. And it’s not just floating, it’s breaking
down into microscopic particles that are now
in our food chain, that are now you know in
the bottom of the ocean. It’s a soup. That’s
us. What are we doing to those animals? That’s
plastic that we are not taking care of. And
I believe the figure is less than 5%. Even
if we recycle this number two, number three,
number five, whatever the numbers, put it
in the bins, very little of it actually gets
recycled. And a lot of it is one time recycle.
It’s not like they can recycle this plastic
over and over. Sometimes it’s only a one time
recycle. So that’s a huge category that people
see their food and it says on the packaging
‘vegan’. Well, it’s in a package. What are
you going to do with that plastic now? And
you buy all those special raw food, nuts,
you know mix, in the plastic, I mean that’s
the plastic. Where is that going? That’s not
recycled. There’s no recycle label usually
on that kind of stuff. And it’s really challenging
to think, for a lot of vegans, for themselves
to take an assessment and go wow here’s a
huge part of my life, I’m involved with a
lot of plastic in my life. Throwing it away,
you know, not consuming it, but having it
as a consumer in my life and I haven’t considered
what they’re doing to the animals. That’s
a huge kaboom. And that’s something that a
lot of people don’t have the courage to take
a look at, take the courage to take a step,
you know, how many times do you go to the
grocery store and you take the plastic bag
and you think oh I’m just putting it in the
recycle bin. Why are you wasting that? Gandhi
tells us, Arun Gandhi, a nephew of Gandhi’s,
tells us a story a foreword story to a book
called Non-violent Communication about how
he went to Gandhi and said can I have another
pencil? And Gandhi is like I just gave you
a pencil a couple of weeks ago, what happened
to that pencil. He goes oh it got short and
I just threw it in the woods. He made, he
spent time with him going in the woods, finding
that pencil that he threw out. He said that’s
violence to nature, to waste your resources.
That tree had grown up and you’re now wasting
resources. So he had him take an entire wall
in his room and write all of the things that
lead up to physical violence. So that was
him giving his nephew an assignment to think
about how things are systemic. And what very
few of us think about how things are all inter-connected.
Where was the person who grew the cotton,
how were they treated? The person who drove
that cotton to the store, to the factory,
the workers in that factory how were they
treated? And that as that was transported
and so the whole lineage of the things we
wear, the things we consume, the things we
interact with, not just oh it has an organic
label on it therefore I am now righteous and
good and I’ve done my part. Oh well that’s
nice, you own a couple t-shirts, congratulations,
and that’s, No, I kind of say it sarcastically
but it is steps in a good direction. And that
certainly by buying organic, you know, you’ve
reduced not eliminated, just because it’s
organic doesn’t mean there’s a 100% elimination
of herbicides, insecticides, fungicides, pesticides,
that eventually lead to humancides. Just because,
just because you’ve done that, that’s a step
in the right direction, but they may at times
you are allowed to use pesticides. So we’re
all progressing. We’re doing what we can and
those are great steps. It’d be great if organic
t-shirts had the threads that were also organic
but they’re not, they’re polyester. Where
does that end up? Think about it. And more
thinking will get us to better places. Not
sticking our head and saying I’m vegan I don’t
want to hear plastic stuff, don’t, you’re
going to throw a monkey wrench into my works
here. You’re going to attack me like I’ve
been attacking all those other people! Oh
and we run away. Okay, well, reduce the attacking.
John: Yeah, I mean, I just want you guys to
be conscious of what you’re doing in your
life. Whether that’s with your diet, with
your food, or plastic products or you know
get paper bags and I shred them up in my paper
shredder and they go into my compost to build
my soil, you know, whenever I can instead
of plastic bags. And, you know, once again,
nobody’s perfect and we’re all on this learning
journey. And I want you guys on this learning
journey to constantly improve what you’re
doing instead of just staying the same, you
know. I mean, that’s one of the motivations
that I do. It’s called cani, c-a-n-i, it’s
called ‘constant and neverending improvement’.
Whether that’s Whether that’s my compassion
to the animals or my eco-friendliness to the
planet in using less plastic by bringing my
bags or by getting paper bags and composting
that and using that on site instead of sending
it to the landfill. My garbage can that goes
out every week, actually collects two times
a week, most of the time I don’t even send
stuff out once a week. Because I don’t make
enough garbage, right. And so I want to encourage
you guys to shop at health food stores and
buy things that don’t have any packaging,
no plastic packaging, you know. Buy things
in bulk, you know, bring your jars back and
get them aired out and fill those up instead
of using plastic bags. And I’m on this journey
too, right. I do the best I can. I’m not perfect
and I’m aware of these things. And creating
awareness is one thing and putting those into
action is definitely another and you know
that’s all we can ask for you guys is to do
the best you can. I make videos like this
to create awareness about these topics that
simply other people are putting plugs in their
ears and not talking about plastic and veganism.
And all these other topics that JD and I are
discussing today. So here’s the thing, you
know, the thing for me is that we’re all on
a journey. Some are further along and if you
want to even gauge if this is further along
than that or whatever. But we’re all on a
journey and we should live with compassion
and also importantly empathy towards others,
right. And I want all you guys to eat more
plants and eat less of anything else. Whether
that’s processed foods, junk foods, animal
foods, and do the best you can. And continually
make progress in the right direction to eat
more plants and get the other foods out of
your life. and the other thing I’d really
like to say is for people that still want
to eat meat, you know, I’ll say this, right,
as much as I don’t necessarily advocate that
or believe it’s healthy, I believe that if
people want to eat meat they should raise
their own animals, chickens, goats, cows,
whatever and kill them themselves, slaughter
them themselves so that they go through the
process and they learn what the process is.
I mean, I for one, could never kill any of
my pets, my pet kitty, my pet dog, to eat
them. And hopefully I believe that people
wouldn’t be able to do that either and that’s
why I like to grow my own food because I can
pick my own vegetables. And you know do minimal
harm to the environment by not tilling my
soil, by growing in a beyond organic fashion
and not having to transport my vegetables
5000 miles so that I can eat them. Because
I just walk out to my back yard and pick them.
So you know, I always want to encourage you
guys to move in the right direction and do
the best you can, live with empathy and compassion.
JD, this video is getting quite long, any
last comments or words that you’d like to
share with my viewers today to help them along
with this whole journey or about any of the
topics we’ve talked about today?
JD: I think by watching John’s videos you
can see his empathy, you can see his passion,
you can see you can model his behaviour, he’s
not a perfect human being, none of us are.
And he’s out helping the world. We’d like
to learn how you’re out helping our human
family in the world. Help us be better human
beings. We’re here to be upgraded, we’re here
to share what we know. And give us more to
share. John there’s a saying I learned, I’m
not sure if it was Harry Truman or something,
but he said most leaders are readers but not,
‘all leaders are readers but not all readers
are leaders’. And so that’s meaning basically
that John is studious, John is constantly
consuming information, he is open to oh you
know I thought about this and now I’m doing
this instead, so watch me grow, watch me improve,
watch me find the next expert, watch me find
the next book, the next thing and stay with
him in his journey, model that for your own
life, be open. John is open to being corrected.
And that takes courage. You have to be secure
in yourself to say okay I didn’t get that
right that time but I’m willing to change
and upgrade and include and take it on and
help us all be better. So that’s really what
John is offering and I’m just sharing what
John , his presence and his information can
provide for you other than the facts and the
data.
John: Thank you, JD. Yeah, I mean, I totally
agree, I’m always open to learning new things
and you know, one of the things that I heard
that I like to repeat a lot is ‘to become
a better teacher you need to become a better
student’. And there’s even people on YouTube
that are teaching me things, that are maybe
don’t have empathy for others and things like
this and you know it makes me sad when I see
that, because this is what they’re teaching
to people that watch them and this is what
we’re raising for the next generation of people
into a plant based vegan diet, right. We’re
teaching people that don’t have empathy, that
just go by the book and you’re right you’re
wrong, you’re good you’re bad. And I want
you guys to always always always think for
yourself. Because there are many injustices
in the world, one of which is the animals
and all the things that are happening to them,
but there’s a lot of other things that are
happening with the government and fluoride
and I could just go on and on about things
I research. It just makes me sad so I just
try to do my part to make the world a healthier
place. And I want to also encourage you guys
to do your part, you know. I have over eighteen
hundred videos now, almost nineteen hundred
of them counted lately, and you know I’m doing
a lot to change the world for the better,
how I see it. And I want to encourage all
you guys out there to change the world for
the better, however you guys can. Whether
that means making videos, whether that means
you know, doing a table, a vegan table to
advocate you know, eating, having people eat
less animals. Whether that means doing things
in politics and getting politics changed that
big corporations are paying off. People that
get their laws, you know, for anything about
having to do with anti-GMOs , going for even
organic and even beyond organic. Whether that
means growing a garden and teaching others
to garden. But I want you guys to make a difference
in the world. Because that’s what I’m doing
and if everybody that is watching this video
did that to help change the world, we could
change this world a whole hell of a lot faster.
Because that’s what really needs to happen,
you know with all the global warming and all
these other crazy things in the world today.
And that’s why I make these videos, right.
It gives me a purpose to live and I want you
guys always to have a purpose in life.
So JD, if somebody wants to learn more about
you and your human excellence and everything
that you do, cause this guy man he’s researched
a lot of topics, many of which actually I
haven’t researched about. That’s why I like
to have experts on my show to share with you
guys all ranges of all kinds of different
people that know things about health, about
this, about that, how can somebody get a hold
of you JD to learn more about you and what
you’re work is doing and all this stuff?
JD: Yes. So this is one of my businesses,
human excellence. It’s humanexcellence.com
and the website is currently under construction
but I’ll have it up soon. And you can find
me with my wife’s website at ecopeaceful.com
and you can find me on Facebook. I started
a few, three, Facebook groups. One is LongTermVegans,
because a lot of people have a debate about
the vegans can’t be long term. So I have a
group of people that are long term, meaning
five years or more. It’s not a black or white
situation here, just a general kind of you
know , people are like oh it’s three years
and up, fine, ten years yeah it’s good. And
then Vegan Influencers And Debaters was a
group that I started to teach people how to
debate. And debate I don’t mean combative,
debate I mean I have this idea you have that
idea, let’s see if we can come to an agreement.
It’s more of a , it’s called a dialectic debate,
rather than a heuristic debate. Not another
video over there. Two ideas, basically, the
heuristic is combative I’m right, you’re wrong,
and the dialectic is lets share and see if
we can learn from each other in a debating
challenging fashion but not a making wrong
fashion. So that’s Vegan Influencers and Debaters.
And then the new one that I co-founded with
my wife and Darrell Elliot is Vegan Influence
and Persuasion. So, some people don’t like
the word debate, it’s not an evil word, it’s
actually very educational when it’s done right.
So that’s we have Persuasion as well. So we
teach people the effective advocacy strategies,
marketing, website, writing, how to communicate,
how to speak, write, all kinds of stuff. It’s
not just go out and hold pamphlets up and
yell at people or have a megaphone and sign.
So there are in some situations more effective
strategies than others. And there’s science
involved in this. And basically science involved
in what are better marketing, what are better
sales techniques, what are better introduction
get your foot in the door and then slowly
gradually improve? What are human development
habit changing? Most people know that habit
changing, people have a difficult time changing
their own habits. Like how many people want
to lose weight and they can’t. I can’t get
myself to change. And yet you yell and scream
at the non vegans to automatically overnight
switch their habit. Or you want to run, you
want to exercise, you want to do something.
Oh I can’t do it, oh I’ve been trying for
years. But them, they, oh supposedly if you
vibrate their eardrums with enough sounds
and yell at them or whatever then magically
overnight with a magic wand they’re going
to turn into a vegan. Doesn’t happen. Most
things are slow and progressive like I had
stated. More like a resister, a dimmer switch
than an on-off light switch. So, there’s a
couple ways. It’s J D Mumma, just two letters
because my first name is Jeffroy with an ‘o’
and I get tired of people mispronouncing it,
so it’s just simple. Jeffroy D, JD, that’s
it. Did you know that?
John: I didn’t , actually that’s something
new I’ve learned today. I’ve learned a lot
of stuff. Alright JD, so yeah I want to encourage
you guys to check those sites out. I’ve put
links down below because I think that every
vegan should do some advocacy, you know, and
that’s what the work I do. Part of the work
I do with the videos is on my videos I always
promote a plant based diet and minimizing
or eliminating all the animal products and
being more effective and this is definitely
a good thing. So yeah check his sites out.
He’s a really smart guy. That’s another reason
why I’m here interviewing him, I mean he knows
a lot about this stuff and human excellence
and getting people to sway their opinion on
things and all that stuff. So yeah very valuable
groups. Check them out for sure. And I mean
the final comments I’d like to say although
I’m not a 100% vegan, a 100% raw, I am a 100%
heterosexual. And I just do the best I can
and that’s all I want for you guys out there,
right. I just want that for you guys to do
the best you can on eating more fresh fruits
and vegetables, eating less of the processed
foods, animal foods, or eliminating them.
And minimizing the cooked foods and you know
do the best you can. And I want to say that
you know I try to make the world a better
place by making my videos. And I want to encourage
you guys, specially you guys are quick to
comment and slow to act, I want to encourage
you guys to take action to make the world
a place that you want to live in. Because
we are all living in it and if you, you know
I have over eighteen hundred videos now that
are trying to make change that I want to see
in the world. I want to encourage all of you
guys out there to do something in your life.
To educate others about being more compassionate,
living with more empathy, you know living
a vegan diet, eating more fresh fruits and
vegetables. We all could do something because
the faster that each of us can reach other
people is the faster we could turn this world
around, the faster we’ll have a nicer planet
to live on and more importantly affecting
change in the kids is critical in this day
and age because kids don’t even know where
fruits and vegetables come from or food comes.
It doesn’t come out of the grocery store or
fast food joint, it simply comes from mother
earth. So yeah, do what you can to make this
world a better place and you know, I want
to let you guys know that I’m not perfect,
I do the best I can. I’m only human, right.
And you guys are only human too. So don’t
beat yourself up or don’t beat me up when
I’m not perfect because I’m not. You know,
my shit stinks sometimes if I’m not eating
properly.
JD: It’s not composted
John: It’s not composted properly. Yeah. In
any case, do the best you guys can. And I’m
glad you guys stayed till the end to watch
this because you know, I know a lot of people,
the majority of people didn’t watch the end.
And it’s important for me to get the whole
message out there and to create awareness
about how I think and this video pretty much
sums up my thoughts on both veganism and raw
foods and why I’m not a 100% of either. And
hopefully now you know why. But you know,
on the flip side I really am raw and I really
am vegan for most people’s definitions, just
not mine. Alright. In any case, hope you guys
enjoyed this episode. If you did, hey please
give me a thumbs up, I’ll come back and
visit JD in the future, I’ll make more videos
with him. Also be sure to click that Subscribe
button right down below. I’ll be teaching
you guys things that you won’t see on other
raw food or even vegan channels on YouTube.
And also be sure to check my past episodes.
I have over four hundred episodes now teaching
you guys all aspects of living on a healthy
plant based raw fruit and vegetable based
diet. So once again, my name is John Kohler
with okraw.com . We’ll see you next time and
until then remember- keep eating your fresh
fruits and vegetables, they’re always
the best!


Why I'm Not Vegan - Is anyone 100% Vegan ?


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